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Scenarios severly unbalanced
Scenarios severly unbalanced Posted on [09/02/2018] à 12:50

Hi all, I was wondering if anybody else noticed that the scenarios in SoN core are severly unbalanced in favour of the deep ones/black sun factions. I know that HPL fiction is about desperate struggles, but giving out nearly 100 more points to the defender, while incredibly hard to take objectives for the poor rangers combined with the devastating mud and swamp effects that the deep ones always ignore sounds really too much. I've been playing the game with my brother since months, we played all the expansions of HoN and the core box, I won them all, so i doubt it's a case of "git gud" here. On some scenario 3 of SoN i've basically cleared it without losing troops, only to be stopped in the cavern by and OP hero that i have to kill at all costs in just 1 or 2 turns top, and he has 2 lives that i can remove only through incredibly risky assaults. Scenario 4 in the cavern, I've got a tremendous objective to reach with the rangers, and a single chokepoint to reach it. He just places his troops there, slows me down and if I lose even a single assault i'm forced to stop in my tracks till next turn, it's not fun and relies exclusively on luck. On most scenarios the deep ones player has to do nothing more than stall the rangers abusing terrain and assaults and the ranger loses.


Just to give a sample of the defender vs attacker points unbalance;


Scenario 2: Objective is placed in the most unreachable corner by the defender, attackers deploy is miserable with troops coming in play from outside of the board.

Attacker PTS: 275

Defender PTS: 265

Scenario is unbalanced following the simple core rules for "scenario generation"


Scenario 3: Objective is very far from the attackers limited deploy, behind swamp and mud terrains and need to be cleared ith assault against a melee hero with melee equipments that can stall it for 2 turns.

Attacker PTS: 270

Defender PTS: 365 WHAAAAT?

Seriously, do I have to comment on this one? The defender has 100 more points than the attacker, absurd.


Scenario 4: super easy to stall for the defender, attacker has to get through a choke points with assaults, fail one and he gets stopped for an entire round.

Attacker PTS: 205

Defender PTS: 190 (45 coming from reinforcments)

Points are a bit less unbalanced, but the chokepoint is too luck reliant.


Scenario 5: The rangers here are on the defensive, and guess what? The points become balanced! I can't understand why they hate rangers so much.

Attacker PTS: 355

Defender PTS: 295


Scenario 7: here we return to rangers attacking, incredibliy difficult scenario with 2 secondary objectives to take and a primary one, deployment zone for the attacker is outside of the board so extra difficulty added.

Attacker PTS: 325

Defender PTS: 395 AGAIN WHAT?


why, why in any scenario the deeps ones/black sun have more points than the rangers, even when they are on the defensive with plenty bonuses from terrain, deployment and objective placement? I am really disappointed, the game looks great but scenarios are messy. Ive yet to play the fnal scenario, but I can be pretty sure that it is going to be unbalanced too given the premises.


Scenarios severly unbalanced Posted on [23/04/2018] à 00:41

I have SON, but must admit I have never played it. Most of my time / effort has gone into HON – which I really like.


I know that in HON, when I design a scenario, I always make sure the attacking force has a 25 – 30% point advantage over the defender. I do move this scale a bit based on the experience of the players involved.


I could see how the point totals you describe in SON would make for some tough scenarios for the Rangers – then again they are Rangers!


Our HON group has talked about doing a SON game or two. I will have to pull SON out and crunch some numbers on the point totals.


Scenarios severly unbalanced Posted on [25/04/2018] à 13:41

Have you played the scenarios ?

I have played the full campaign twice and I don't find the scenarios "severly unbalanced" 😉


Scenarios severly unbalanced Posted on [25/04/2018] à 14:31

I’ve been playing Desert Wrath recently, and the scenarios there are no better. Really unfortunate as I enjoy this theme more than just HoN, and also think that the by not having heavy amour the game is inherently better. But ANY war gamer knows that an attacking force needs to be larger by at least a third, and though this isn’t strictly a game representative of war, it is close-enough-to to have to follow that stricture.


Scenarios severly unbalanced Posted on [25/04/2018] à 17:56

So what does gduprez know that we are missing? There must be some element that helps balance the game if you understand it correctly. 😉


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Remember: If you are not willing to shell your own position you are not willing to win!

Scenarios severly unbalanced Posted on [25/04/2018] à 19:01

I haven't played the SoN scenarios so I can't comment on balance. But you could always increase the points availabe to the attacker to about 130% of the defender if you prefer.

I am curious as to gduprez's answer though. Maybe you could take one of the scenarios mentioned and comment on what balances out the point difference? 🙂


Cedric van Aerssen

Scenarios severly unbalanced Posted on [27/04/2018] à 19:24

I will try to explain you all the parameters I use to balance scenrios.

Unfortunately my english is not very fluent…

I will write my answer in french and ask somebody for the translation and then publish it…


Scenarios severly unbalanced Posted on [30/04/2018] à 21:47

We played all the SoN scenarios last year and had a blast doing so. I view them as learning tutorials more than anything else. If you look at them that way you can see how they add different rules and units as you play through them and then just have fun playing them.


We alternated playing both sides and after every two weeks just looked at who did a better job in terms of trying to determine a "winner".


I have no doubt that we will have just as much fun playing the Desert Wrath scenarios.


For a balanced scenario I would look at just following the rules for creating your own.


Scenarios severly unbalanced Posted on [30/04/2018] à 21:50

In terms of some of the specific scenarios, you have to play to your strengths. In the scenarios in the caves, the Majestic player can holds onto the all terrain card (I think that's its name) and can try to sneak through the underground water passages. When we played my opponent almost got out of one of them by doing so.


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