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Aircraft Mechanics?
Attacking from the rear (Heavy Vehicles) & Airplanes posté le [01/02/2019] à 20:56

Quote from Nostradunwhich on [01/02/2019] à 20:10

I got a ruling from Clem. Aircraft always attack the top of a unit, and so do not get a bonus for attacking the rear of a Heavy Vehicle.


Thank you for the follow-up. Nice to know what the "official" answer is. :mrgreen:


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Attacking from the rear (Heavy Vehicles) & Airplanes posté le [01/02/2019] à 22:26

Quote from Nostradunwhich on [01/02/2019] à 20:10

I got a ruling from Clem. Aircraft always attack the top of a unit, and so do not get a bonus for attacking the rear of a Heavy Vehicle.


And before you ask, I asked what to do in the case of Aircraft in HoN, when vehicles can have different armor values. Good to cover that before the HoN Comp. Ed. gets printed so thanks to Eclo and jyonkers for bringing it up!


Thanks ! Happy we got an official answer.


Attacking from the rear (Heavy Vehicles) & Airplanes posté le [02/02/2019] à 09:02

No ruling for the range?


This is supposed to be a joyful occasion. Lets not bicker and argue about who killed who.

Attacking from the rear (Heavy Vehicles) & Airplanes posté le [02/02/2019] à 10:03

Quote from Colhammer on [02/02/2019] à 09:02

No ruling for the range?


Oops! Question asked.


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Attacking from the rear (Heavy Vehicles) & Airplanes posté le [02/02/2019] à 10:10

Glad we had Clem’s answer. I’m also curious about the range bonus now.


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Attacking from the rear (Heavy Vehicles) & Airplanes posté le [04/02/2019] à 20:55

More follow-ups:


Aircraft in HoN will use the lowest armor value, as suspected 🙂


As for the range bonus, this is another part of the "quantum uncertainty" of aircraft — by which I mean they interact with the board but are not actually on the board. So they do not use the full set of mechanics.


That is why they:

1) Always have Clear LoS to every unit which is not in a building,

2) Do not get a bonus for attacking from a particular direction, and

3) They do not deal with range penalties either for shooting at or for being shot by units,


Any modifiers for things like range are "baked in" to the Attacks and Defense of the Aircraft.


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Attacking from the rear (Heavy Vehicles) & Airplanes posté le [04/02/2019] à 21:26

Sweet! Thanks for looking for the answers! It sounds exactly like I already played the HoBR aircraft.


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Attacking from the rear (Heavy Vehicles) & Airplanes posté le [04/02/2019] à 21:50

That is clear enough. I shall now play with the aircraft using these rule clarifications.


Thanks for asking the ruling, Nostra, and thanks DPG for clearing this up! 🙂


This is supposed to be a joyful occasion. Lets not bicker and argue about who killed who.

Attacking from the rear (Heavy Vehicles) & Airplanes posté le [05/02/2019] à 01:36

Quote from Colhammer on [04/02/2019] à 21:50

Thanks for asking the ruling, Nostra, and thanks DPG for clearing this up! 🙂


I agree, thanks for getting us clear answers. :mrgreen:


Member of the « Cult of the Inexisting New » – Thanks bartdevuyst

Attacking from the rear (Heavy Vehicles) & Airplanes posté le [20/02/2019] à 15:52

Can aircrafts be shot at even if they don't have an order token?


Attacking from the rear (Heavy Vehicles) & Airplanes posté le [20/02/2019] à 21:28

Quote from LionSaurus on [20/02/2019] à 15:52

Can aircrafts be shot at even if they don't have an order token?


What are the rules for the Aircraft Special Ability?


If is says that units always have LoS to an aircraft, then they do. If it says they only have LoS when the unit is activated, then it is limited as you suggest.


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Remember: If you are not willing to shell your own position you are not willing to win!

Attacking from the rear (Heavy Vehicles) & Airplanes posté le [20/02/2019] à 21:37

Aircraft always have Clear LOS to everything on the battlefield that is not inside a building and everything not in buildings always have clear LOS to aircraft.


This is supposed to be a joyful occasion. Lets not bicker and argue about who killed who.

Attacking from the rear (Heavy Vehicles) & Airplanes posté le [21/02/2019] à 01:17

Quote from Colhammer on [20/02/2019] à 21:37

Aircraft always have Clear LOS to everything on the battlefield that is not inside a building and everything not in buildings always have clear LOS to aircraft.


I have to admit, that troubles me a bit. If I bring the gunship then anything can shoot it and if my opponent brings any anti-light armor it's pretty doomed from the get go. That's 40 points wasted for nothing.


Do others find this balanced? My competitive side would never allow me to bring a 40 point unit that just dies as soon as my opponent gets his/her turn =p


Attacking from the rear (Heavy Vehicles) & Airplanes posté le [21/02/2019] à 08:26

I still haven't used any flyers in my games, so I don't know how vulnerable they really are.


But this was why I was suggesting the "always at long range" rule for them as it would give them some protection.


But now the ruling is that shooting from or at flyer , there is no modifiers for range.


I don't expect the flyers to stay in the air for long. The first few turn, when you don't really have many targets to shoot (before the forces move closer to each other), you might as well take a few pot shots at the pesky flyer.


I guess the flyer is really meant to shoot something valuable in turn 1 (using order number 1 or a special order) and then go away (i.e. it won't be in the air for long)?

Just make sure the flyer kills/wounds something good (tank, officer, heavy weapon) and perhaps the points used in it are not wasted after all.


This is supposed to be a joyful occasion. Lets not bicker and argue about who killed who.

Attacking from the rear (Heavy Vehicles) & Airplanes posté le [21/02/2019] à 09:32

Quote from Colhammer on [21/02/2019] à 08:26

I don't expect the flyers to stay in the air for long. The first few turn, when you don't really have many targets to shoot (before the forces move closer to each other), you might as well take a few pot shots at the pesky flyer.


Last 2 games were a "one shot, one kill" versus Flyers.


First scenario the Ork Blitza-Bommer in turn 2 (no shot in turn 1) and second scenario the Stormtalon gunship in turn 1 (with order token 1).


Aircraft are fun to play with but they are not around for long.


Attacking from the rear (Heavy Vehicles) & Airplanes posté le [22/02/2019] à 08:07

Yeah, that sounds less fun. We might actually house rule it and make it so you can only shoot at aircrafts with order tokens on them as currently aircraft seems like a waste of points as they become an easy kill for the opponent.


Attacking from the rear (Heavy Vehicles) & Airplanes posté le [22/02/2019] à 08:21

Quote from LionSaurus on [22/02/2019] à 08:07

Yeah, that sounds less fun. We might actually house rule it and make it so you can only shoot at aircrafts with order tokens on them as currently aircraft seems like a waste of points as they become an easy kill for the opponent.


We also had battles were aircraft survived the entire game…


It all depends on the battlefield layout and the size of the battle (= number of tokens)


The 2 examples I gave were both battlefields with a big wall in the middle, so the first 2 turns were not that important (just moving to the wall that blocked line of sight) and then the only thing that could be shot was the aircraft. And both scenarios were large (600pts & 900pts), so that means a lot of order tokens (10 for the Orks in the 900pts game). So at least 1 or 2 could be spared to shoot at the aircraft.


Thus, depending on the battlefield layout AND on the size of battle (smaller is better) Aircraft become more useful and survive longer.


Attacking from the rear (Heavy Vehicles) & Airplanes posté le [22/02/2019] à 09:16

Also remember that a unit balance doesn't only lies in how many time it stays on the battlefield. Flyers (especially the space marines one) have very high offensive stats without range penalty and with ultimate line of sight for only 40 points.

The Ork army have only few weapons good against light vehicules and without range limitation (meaning capable of destroying the storm talon). In small encounters like 300 points, take the stormtalon with a special order (easy since they both require a command tile), start by taking out what is likely to be the only unit capable of destroying your stormtalon (big shoota, battle wagon or deff dread, unlikely to be 2 of them). If you do, battle is over even before your opponent gets to play.


If you want flyers to be more balanced, changing only their survivability is in my opinion might mean they become even more unbalanced.


Sweat saves blood, blood saves lives, but brains saves both. Erwin Rommel

Attacking from the rear (Heavy Vehicles) & Airplanes posté le [22/02/2019] à 17:47

One house rule I'd like to try : you can't target aircraft before they have received their first order.

To me it won't change their game balance but you will be able to choose when they'll come to die ^^

It might also be seen as the aircraft still on it's way waiting for his "clear to go" order.


Attacking from the rear (Heavy Vehicles) & Airplanes posté le [22/02/2019] à 19:28

Quote from Anacreon on [22/02/2019] à 09:16

Also remember that a unit balance doesn't only lies in how many time it stays on the battlefield. Flyers (especially the space marines one) have very high offensive stats without range penalty and with ultimate line of sight for only 40 points.

The Ork army have only few weapons good against light vehicles and without range limitation (meaning capable of destroying the storm talon). In small encounters like 300 points, take the stormtalon with a special order (easy since they both require a command tile), start by taking out what is likely to be the only unit capable of destroying your stormtalon (big shoota, battle wagon or deff dread, unlikely to be 2 of them). If you do, battle is over even before your opponent gets to play.


If you want flyers to be more balanced, changing only their survivability is in my opinion might mean they become even more unbalanced.


Very important considerations, thanks for pointing them out.


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